AMD info

[Grimmy]

Ok guys, I am not good at this, but I want to build one so bad. What I am looking for, becuase I don't know anything about this, AMD top processor. In another post, I think one of Hammer's, he said something about the AMDD 3000+. Is that out? I look on what I thought was AMD's site, and they only had the 2700 & 2800. I was impressed with the benchmarks it had. I looked for the mobo they using and then I saw a litte note saying that it wasn't available. This is what they are running for a mobo:

Asus A7N8X nForce2 Motherboard
Epox 8K3A+ KT333 Motherboard

But I don't know where to buy. I would like to buy a combo, that way they have a warrenty if they put the processor in, stuff like that.

As for a case, a kewl one. I seem some with lights in the side and fans there too. Can you order them like that??

As for RAM, plan on running a gig. HD, not sure, what brands are good? Would like atleast 1 100 giger, maybe 2.

Vid card? ATI Radeon (sorry can spellskejr) 9700 or a nVidia?

Once I get the tower built, I will look at monitors. Would melt on a 20 some incher flat panel :mrgreen: but I can't fork out that much for a monitor.

Also, I will be running XP pro. I am looking for a DVD/CR burner. They are becoming more reasonable now, and maybe just a 48-52 ROM in the other bay.

Let me know what you think of this. I would like the AMD 3000 proc if it is out. If you have links for some of this stuff, please let me know.

O before I forget, I talked to a guy about a dual proc, and he said that I wouldn't really see a difference in it, becuase the game/program has to be able to support a dual proc. Also, those are way more expensive.

Thanks for ya time and look forward to hearing your thoughts! 8)

[OUTLAWS The Machine]

Will write more tonight, but, 3000+ probably won't be out until next year. The 2800+ should be out in the next month or 2. It will be the first AMD processor to support the 333MHz frontside bus. the Nforce2 boards should be out real soon. Crucial RAM I recommend, the new Nvidia cards should be out in December.

[Grimmy]

Ok, then I might wait till after the New Year. That way some of the stuff will be out and I can start piecing together the goodies :lol:

[OUTLAWS Behind You?]

[quote:3304bfdd9f]O before I forget, I talked to a guy about a dual proc, and he said that I wouldn't really see a difference in it, becuase the game/program has to be able to support a dual proc. [/quote:3304bfdd9f]

Man, I'm getting really tired of this misconception. The operating system must support dual processors, not the game. Windows XP Pro does, XP Home does not. The operating system schedules dispatchable tasks to one or the other processor. If the game spawns multiple dispatchable tasks, then, two can be scheduled simultaniously. The game or any other application, in today's world, should not know or care about how many processors are running.

Besides, no matter what you think, you have more than just the game running. Check out task manager processes tab.

Also, don't get to thinking that twice the processors equals twice the speed. You lose some cycles in overhead. It averages about 1.7 to 1.8 times greater than one.

[FUS1ON]

Hey Behind You?, Great post. :wink:

Grimmy I'm not sure, But it seems like I remember reading over at the S! site that SS isn't one of the games that takes advantage of dual procs. anyway. But if your building it for some other reason or game, Well that's a different story.

[OUTLAWS The Machine]

INteresting post Behind You. So you are saying that if you are using WinXP Pro then you will see a significant performance increase no matter what game you are playing?

[Grimmy]

[quote:5c9686aea8="OUTLAWS SHOGUN"]Hey Behind You?, Great post. :wink:

Grimmy I'm not sure, But it seems like I remember reading over at the S! site that SS isn't one of the games that takes advantage of dual procs. anyway. But if your building it for some other reason or game, Well that's a different story.[/quote:5c9686aea8]

Well I just wanna built a puter. A kick ass one. Who knows, I might not keep it, for I don't have much room with the one that I have now to keep both, but that one isn't mine and I don't pay for it. All the talk about new processors and mobo's and vid cards coming out, I want to check em out.

O and you can really spam with 2 puters, as long as the keyboards are close together hehehe but I wouldn't do that :twisted:

[OUTLAWS Behind You?]

[quote:e8cb520bca="OUTLAWS The Machine"]INteresting post Behind You. So you are saying that if you are using WinXP Pro then you will see a significant performance increase no matter what game you are playing?[/quote:e8cb520bca]

With WinXP Pro and dual processors, at the total system level, yes. At the individual program level, maybe, maybe not. Each processor can do only [b:e8cb520bca][u:e8cb520bca]one[/u:e8cb520bca][/b:e8cb520bca] instruction at a time. (It gets more complicated with pipelines and cacheing.) They just do these instructions very fast. Each operating system has to create and maintain something called a dispatchable process. A dispatchable process executes instructions, one at a time, on a single processor to perform its work. Two processors can be doing system work, process work or any two combinations at any instant. A program can be one process or many.

I cannot imagine any recent game that would not spawn multiple processes that communicate between themselves. For instance, a process to produce the music, another for sound effects, and yet another for mouse inputs. Not to mention a process or two for graphics.

This is called multi-tasking and has been going on for a long time. Multi-tasking happens these days even on a single processor. While one process is waiting for something to happen, some other process is executing. This procedure is the same with two or more processors. Each processor is executing something or waiting if there is nothing to execute. (Waiting happens far more often that one would imagine, even with an intensive game as SS-SE.)

I hope this explains things better.

[FUS1ON]

[quote:a417ac7655="Grimmy"]
Well I just wanna built a puter. A kick ass one. Who knows, I might not keep it, for I don't have much room with the one that I have now to keep both, but that one isn't mine and I don't pay for it. All the talk about new processors and mobo's and vid cards coming out, I want to check em out.

O and you can really spam with 2 puters, as long as the keyboards are close together hehehe but I wouldn't do that :twisted:[/quote:a417ac7655]

I suggest subscribing to MaximumPC magizine http://www.maximumpc.com/. If you buy it off the newsstand it's $7.99 :shock: an issue, but you can get 12 issues for $29 by subscribing. When you renew you can get 12 issues for $10 if you elect to not get the CDs. Lotsa goooood info packed in between the covers. :wink:

[OUTLAWS The Machine]

Behind You - Are there any benchmarks anywhere that I can look at comparing single vs dual processors in gaming situations?

[Grimmy]

I would like to see some benchmarks of that too. I mean it I was a awesome puter, then I want to get the right goodies! But like to know what I am getting first before I am stuck with it.

[Grimmy]

[quote:a0fb9f94f6="Behind You?"][quote:a0fb9f94f6="OUTLAWS The Machine"]INteresting post Behind You. So you are saying that if you are using WinXP Pro then you will see a significant performance increase no matter what game you are playing?[/quote:a0fb9f94f6]

With WinXP Pro and dual processors, at the total system level, yes. At the individual program level, maybe, maybe not. Each processor can do only [b:a0fb9f94f6][u:a0fb9f94f6]one[/u:a0fb9f94f6][/b:a0fb9f94f6] instruction at a time. (It gets more complicated with pipelines and cacheing.) They just do these instructions very fast. Each operating system has to create and maintain something called a dispatchable process. A dispatchable process executes instructions, one at a time, on a single processor to perform its work. Two processors can be doing system work, process work or any two combinations at any instant. A program can be one process or many.

I cannot imagine any recent game that would not spawn multiple processes that communicate between themselves. For instance, a process to produce the music, another for sound effects, and yet another for mouse inputs. Not to mention a process or two for graphics.

This is called multi-tasking and has been going on for a long time. Multi-tasking happens these days even on a single processor. While one process is waiting for something to happen, some other process is executing. This procedure is the same with two or more processors. Each processor is executing something or waiting if there is nothing to execute. (Waiting happens far more often that one would imagine, even with an intensive game as SS-SE.)

I hope this explains things better.[/quote:a0fb9f94f6]

It sorta does. So would you say it would be better to get a dual, or stay with a single?

[OUTLAWS The Machine]

Get a single Grimmy. I'm just curious as to the performance advantage. The dual mobo's are really expensive and you don't want to buy 2 cpus.

[Zero[GummiBear]]

So many posts, I don't want to try to quote them all. :)

Dual processor machine = great for heavy I/O and lots of processing. NOT GREAT for gaming. If it's a gaming machine you want, get a fast single-CPU setup. You're not going to notice enough difference in your game between the two systems to warrant the extra expense.

Not only does the operating system have to support Symmetric Muilti Processing (SMP), but the application you're running has to support it as well. If you're doing lots of video editing with Adobe Premiere, then by all means, get a dual CPU system for it. Premiere is SMP-capable, and will send info to both processors for simultaneous execution.

As fas as games go, the only recent game that supported SMP was Quake 3 Arena, and it did a piss-poor job of it. iD basically said "It's in there, but it sucks. Don't use it." UT2K3, both dedicated server and retail game, do NOT support SMP. If you run it on a dual-processor box, it'll run on one processor by itself, not on both. The operating system might see both CPU's, but the game won't.

Hope some of that helps. :)

Zero[GummiBear]

[OUTLAWS The Machine]

That's what I though Zero. That's why I wanted to see some benches. Bragging rights would be great though. LOL

[OUTLAWS DirtGod]

well im getting them next summer anyway dual hammers.......and new nvidia card ......bragging right...:)

[OUTLAWS Behind You?]

Get a fast single, P4, with an Intel Chipset.

[FUS1ON]

Machine take a look at MaximumPC's January 2002 issue page 31 for some benchmarks. I would scanned it but my scanner is acting up.

[Grimmy]

[quote:a0a778af54="Behind You?"]Get a fast single, P4, with an Intel Chipset.[/quote:a0a778af54]

Is Intell better and faster then AMD?? Just wondering, never been on an AMD system before so I don't know.

[Sauron]

IMO AMD is better cause half the price for same power :)

[OUTLAWS Behind You?]

[quote:8ab71415b2="Grimmy"][quote:8ab71415b2="Behind You?"]Get a fast single, P4, with an Intel Chipset.[/quote:8ab71415b2]

Is Intell better and faster then AMD?? Just wondering, never been on an AMD system before so I don't know.[/quote:8ab71415b2]

Personal preference. I got tired of running the VIA 4in1 updates every other month. And my new ATI Radeon 9700 Pro warned that for any chipset other than Intel, make sure that its updates are installed before installing the card. I stated a P4 because I do not think there are many MBs with Intel chipsets for AMD.

[FUS1ON]

Hey Behind You? it's great to see you posting more. :jammin:

[OUTLAWS Behind You?]

Got bored at work, and then went got on a soap box about dual processors. Hope I didn't offend anybody. I just strongely believe in multiple processors. Even if the game doesn't run on both, it isn't being interrupted by other processes running which run on the other cpu. Oh well, old system mainframers never die, they just fade into the background partition.



Wonder if anybody remembers IBM 360-30 DOS and one backgound partition and two foreground ones, all in 64K. :smilecolros:

[OUTLAWS Behind You?]

Sorry, didn't mean to post twice....

[FUS1ON]

Are you talking about the model 360-20, 30 and 40 from the sixties?

[OUTLAWS Behind You?]

That was the model 30. The model 20 was a joke, even its time. And yes, they were first introduced in the sixties, however, I didn't work on them until the seventies. At millions apiece, you just didn't throw it out because a newer model was introduced.

[FUS1ON]

I really didn't have a clue what you were talking about. I cheated, I ask my dad. :P He worked for IBM for 33 years as an engineer repairing those.

[OUTLAWS Behind You?]

I've been working with them since 1970, hmm, 32 years. Tell your dad that I was in system software development for a 3rd party vendor that went by the names of UCC, then UCCEL, then CA. I got out of system software in 1989.

Still work with a newer IBM mainframe, 9672 model 44, four processors, I think, just not in system software development anymore.

[FUS1ON]

Will do. I'll have to do it later, He's watching Bill O'Rielly right now and he'll "spin my zone" if I disturb him again. :D

Keep the posting up, We like hearing from you! :wink:

[OUTLAWS Behind You?]

Will do.

Hey, I just noticed, I'm not a junior member anymore. I'm a full fledge member. :smilecolros:

[FUS1ON]

Well Congrats to you! :jammin:

[Grimmy]

Maybe I will just call Dell and see if I can upgrade, they send me the proc and a few other things.

[FUS1ON]

Hey Grimmy, Don't get your hopes too high with that move. Most of the time you are limited to certain maximum size proc., especially with Dell, IBM, HP, etc... type machines. :(

[Grimmy]

You are probably right, but a call wouldn't hurt. I have a 1.9Ghz proc now. I think I should just do a clean format, but because it is a dell, I don't have that actual install CD. That is what gets me thinking to build one. Just don't know which way to go.