Weapon Ban Lifted at Midinght

[OUTLAWS WHOCARES]

WTF is this crap. Great let the crooks get the weapons that the Cops can't fight against.

Way to go Bush.

[UZI]

Name one caliber of weapon that the assault weapons ban prevented people from buying?

Malvo and that other wacko shot all of those people around Virginia and DC using a legally acquired .223 caliber variation of an AR 15 (same cal as the military M16). The AR (assault rifle) 15 was a banned weapon. I have an old army buddy who has a legally acquired 50 cal. (not automatic) He put holes through an old engine block at 400 yards. Any criminal can modify a legally acquired gun, or buy it on the black market. Waiting periods and background checks are far more effective.

Most weapons dealers/makers found loop holes around the Assault Weapons Ban, so that law had basically become worthless. Most knowledgeable activist on both sides of the issue knew the law had become worthless.

A much better Law needs to be constructed, so it is better that the old law expired. It is just another lame issue that both sides are using against each other. The Democrates lost a bunch of house seats in congress in the early 90's when they led the Assault Weapons Ban (many rural areas voted on this issues), so none of them wanted to lead the charge this year either. Why do you think you didn't hear anything about it until only a short period before the ban ended (i.e not enough time for anyone to do anything). Hell, Kerry didn't touch it until a couple days before the ban ended. He is a member of the Senate and could have started a new bill at anytime and used his presidential run press coverage to force it to the house. Benefit to terrorists my a$$. Last I heard, McVae (spelling?) used Ammonia Nitrate and the 9/11 bastards used box cutters and an airplane.

Welcome to the wonderful world of spin politics. Where it all sounds good, but in practical terms, it doesn't mean anything and it doesn't have the intended affect.

[UZI]

And don't get me wrong here. I am not a gun nut. I sold every gun I owned the first day my oldest son learned to walk. He pulled himself up on a chair and took his first steps. One hour later, I had rounded up every gun I owned and went to the local gun store and sold them.

[ME BIGGD01]

uzi, you beat me to it again.

i swear it seems people just want to believe anything and not know all the facts. no offence who but uzi is right. i currently own a few assault rifles that are legal. at midnight, i will be able to put a folding stock on my ak and do some other cosmetics to my other 2nd amend/right to have.

if people think that if youu took the guns away from people, there wouldnt be any crime, they are nuts and should evaluate the statistics.

don't believe the democrats when they make some big stink about this. it's just another ploy to try to make the president look bad. they thrive on the ignorance of americans but they do not realize there are people out there that actually know the facts.

if you ask me why i have these weapons, i will plainly tell you they are there to protect my rights. it's kind of a catch 22 to those who oppose my rights.

[ME BIGGD01]

also uzi, the ar15 is legal and my best friend bought one last year. i was going to also but the timing was bad. :thumbs:

[EXEcution]

all i ever wanted from life was a rocket launcher
thank you mr president =D


jk

[solid snake295]

has anyone here seen the movie bowling for columbine?... i guess not :dunno:

[ME BIGGD01]

i will not watch anything from that fat slob. that guy knows nothing. i am still hoping someone hates him a little more than me and puts multiple bullets in his skull and his fat ass. i cant believe people would pay to see his movies and these are the people claiming bush has drained all there money. give me a break:mad: .

oh anser to the question--no, must of missed it:down:

[Slice]

Name one caliber of weapon that the assault weapons ban prevented people from buying?

Malvo and that other wacko shot all of those people around Virginia and DC using a legally acquired .223 caliber variation of an AR 15 (same cal as the military M16). The AR (assault rifle) 15 was a banned weapon. I have an old army buddy who has a legally acquired 50 cal. (not automatic) He put holes through an old engine block at 400 yards. Any criminal can modify a legally acquired gun, or buy it on the black market. Waiting periods and background checks are far more effective.

Most weapons dealers/makers found loop holes around the Assault Weapons Ban, so that law had basically become worthless. Most knowledgeable activist on both sides of the issue knew the law had become worthless.

A much better Law needs to be constructed, so it is better that the old law expired. It is just another lame issue that both sides are using against each other. The Democrates lost a bunch of house seats in congress in the early 90's when they led the Assault Weapons Ban (many rural areas voted on this issues), so none of them wanted to lead the charge this year either. Why do you think you didn't hear anything about it until only a short period before the ban ended (i.e not enough time for anyone to do anything). Hell, Kerry didn't touch it until a couple days before the ban ended. He is a member of the Senate and could have started a new bill at anytime and used his presidential run press coverage to force it to the house. Benefit to terrorists my a$$. Last I heard, McVae (spelling?) used Ammonia Nitrate and the 9/11 bastards used box cutters and an airplane.

Welcome to the wonderful world of spin politics. Where it all sounds good, but in practical terms, it doesn't mean anything and it doesn't have the intended affect.
Dig a little deeper my friend, you will find that George Bush's administration knew about the cells in this country and did squat about it. I watched an interesting 2 hour show about the whole 9/11 event last night and I almost threw up at the end of it realizing the information our government had, months and weeks before the attack. Of course you could just buy the 9/11 report to discover this out as well.

[Slice]

has anyone here seen the movie bowling for columbine?... i guess not :dunno:
I have watched it and found it very informative and true. I love when they went to Kmart headquarters and changed the store policy almost on the spot for the store to quit stocking ammo.

[noldhor]

I have watched it and found it very informative and true. I love when they went to Kmart headquarters and changed the store policy almost on the spot for the store to quit stocking ammo.


I agree Slice:)

[merkwannabe]

I don't see a reason why people should have war weapons... I mean, I guess if there was some alien invasion or some other freak event then maybe ok... Anyway, I think people should be able to protect themselves since police can't always be around and that if anything the government should start by increasing background checks and overall keeping tabs on the dangerous weapons out there by maintaining like a yearly registration type deal.. I can see how there are arguments on both sides, but something needs to be done no matter what because somehow kids and criminals are too easily getting their hands on weapons.. Sure, we shouldn't worry about good people with guns, but how can the government or gun shop know who is good and who is not? By tatoos or some rap sheet?

Anyway, I obviously don't know anything about this because I'm only 18, could care less about guns, and will never be buying one.. ;)

With this said, I hope nobody says I don't know what I am talking about because I already said it!1 mwhaha haha!! :)

[Slice]

i will not watch anything from that fat slob. that guy knows nothing. i am still hoping someone hates him a little more than me and puts multiple bullets in his skull and his fat ass. i cant believe people would pay to see his movies and these are the people claiming bush has drained all there money. give me a break:mad: .

oh anser to the question--no, must of missed it:down:
Ha Ha Long live Michael Moore!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Freedom of Speech
Long live his legacy!
Question authority!

[BobtheCkroach]

if people think that if youu took the guns away from people, there wouldnt be any crime, they are nuts and should evaluate the statistics.



Wasn't there a study out in Colorado or something that showed just that? I think somewhere out west, a city passed a law that required citizens of the community to own a handgun...and crime went to like zero. It seems that people are afraid to do unto others when they're afraid that "others" are packing heat...

[Thundarr]

I am all for people having the freedom to arm themselves, but come on... Really, who NEEDS to have an assault weapon capable of doing that much harm to someone??? Yes, I think that the weapons ban left WAY too many loopholes to be truly effective, but it was better than nothing IMO... If I had my choice, it would have been a stronger law to begin with... :)

[ME BIGGD01]

slice, i am all for freedom of speech but i do not think it's right for that fat slob to make lies and show them as truth. i guess it comes down to personal knowledge of the facts but i still hope he gets sniped.:thumbs:

as for assualt weapons, i would never give mine up. am i some freak in some cult? no, i am not but i believe that one day i may have to use my weapons to protect my family and with that i want the most powerful tools to do so. i may live to never have to use them in self defence but i feel safer knowing i have them. i will tell you this...no one will be leaving my house alive if they tresspassed. that's why i have the no tresspassing sign on the front and back of the house. i also do not trust the gov't/feds and although i follow the rules and break no laws, i would die preventing anyone to deny my constitutional rights. i consider myself an american and there was a time it was people like us that had to use there weapons to keep america. back then they were called patriots but today, you are known as a terrorist. i am all about survival if need be. most people arent and that's their choice. i am prepared regardless if anything and i said anything happends. are you?

people that own tthese weapons are not usually the people who commit crimes. do the research and check to see what is being used in most murders/homicides. as for the police worrying about assualt weaapons, thats bs because i know many of cops that have more rifles tthan i do. also if we look into that theory, why would cops need glocks these days?

if someone wants too kill someone, there are manyy ways they can do it. you would have to ban everything in the world to prevent it. it's not the guns, it's the people that are killing.

[JIMINATOR]

it's not the guns, it's the people that are killing.

i miss the good old days of drive-by knifings...

[ME BIGGD01]

i miss the good old days of drive-by knifings...
you bring up a good point jim. the gangs in the streets... how many of them do you think have registered guns?


i think the politicians should spend more time getting the criminals off the streets:thumbs:

[merkwannabe]

i miss the good old days of drive-by knifings...ROFL

LoL, while it's true guns are fueling many murders, there's still going to be crimes even without guns.. This reminds me of a Futurama episode where the "dad," (I dunno his name cause it's one of the only episodes I've seen :(), built a colony and started making guns.. His "advisors" asked him why he was making weapons so people could commit crimes.. And he replied, "because when those crimes occur, we are gonna need these guns to stop them!!!" haha I know it probably doesn't make sense how I described it, but it was really funny in the episode.. hehe

What I mean is, that most people are afraid to kill someone face to face and with guns they don't have to. They can keep their distance and be in a sense what we would call "cheap" in Sam. So if guns are eliminated many murders will be too... Of course the world isn't perfect and I feel much safer knowing police have guns.. :S So, I don't know where I'm going with this post..

[end of ramblings]

I'm gonna stay out of these threads now.. They are too confusing.. :lol:

[Free Styler]

quote:i may live to never have to use them in self defence but i feel safer knowing i have them. i will tell you this...no one will be leaving my house alive if they tresspassed. that's why i have the no tresspassing sign on the front and back of the house.

Remind me not to go to your lan partys.If i were to sleepwalk by some weird concidence i would not want to be near that sigh of yours hehe(i dont sleep walk but you never know hehe.)

i usally dont state my opinions on these sort of affairs,but i'll say this.

I think eventully man kind will auto destruct themselves.
Feeling safe?For me is knowing i'll die peacefully,hopefully anyhows.

A world where people im not stating any countrys btw,let children die of hungar to supplie themselves with massive destruction armory is completly ridiculous.

Now of course theres a bigger picture to all that.politics,economie having armory to protect oneself.

But....When i'll be roting underground at the age of 90 of plus hehe or and hashches.

I would of prefered giving semething else then weapons to the community.

now what im going to say may seem weird but...If a advance and peacefull civilazation would to come and look at our world.

This is what they would see of man kind.People watching tv where people get there head exploded and us viewers laughing or guts out cause we tought it was in a funny circumtance.

Enough said,they would judge us has a uncivilized and barbaric species.And imo of course they would not be far from the truth.

nowaydays people are corrupted by power and money.And that's all there is to it.
Btw i was talking about hungar in the world,that being said i will probably never give a penny to charity.And i'll still enjoy watching action and horror movies. And will keep playing FPS games.Tho i'm glad to say that i never particulary enjoyed the viloence in video games nor that i really cared about it.

All in all have your gun if it suits you.it wont change much in any case.
if they would ban everything,the black market would pick it up even more and people would still buy them anyhows.

I truly would of liked to have a time machine just to go see 1000years from today to see what it would be like.If there were still a place to visit that is.

[Die Hard]

Whats wrong with fat people??

[PimpDaddy]

WTF is this crap. Great let the crooks get the weapons that the Cops can't fight against.

Way to go Bush. Hi everyone.... couldnt pass this one up :):) Just wanted to let all of you who think that guns kill (which is the original hidden message in this post before people started sticking up for the slimey beeotch dirt bag worthless :down::down::down: treasonous please move to a socialist country because he obviously HATES America because he's just a communist sympathizer pu$$y m.moore)

... Ted Kennedy's car has killed more people than my gun !!!

love ya
pimp

[OUTLAWS WHOCARES]

You all may have me wrong. I own guns alot of them. I think every person should carry one at all times. But these are beyound what I would consider a gun.

[OUTLAWS WHOCARES]

But you have to remember there are several things that run this country and itisn't the President.
Money/Oil

[solid snake295]

slice, i am all for freedom of speech but i do not think it's right for that fat slob to make lies and show them as truth.but its perfectly ok for this f**ktard "the leader of the free world" to feed everyone a nice hefty shovel full of BS every now and then?


http://www.thespoof.com/picstore/thespoof/davidbaker_mad%20bush.jpg

[Goober]

Ok...just couldn't keep out of this one.
Just because there was an assault weapon ban ennacted a few years ago didn't mean you couldn't buy one anyway, the same goes for the high capacity magazines. Any of these items that were made before the ban and were in warehouses were still allowed to be sold. So it's not like you couldn't buy them at all.
According to FBI statistics released a about the same time as the ban, less than 1% of all gun crimes were committed with the guns that were banned. All that ban was intended to do was make some politicians feel good about protecting their voting public(getting re elected). It had nothing to do with actually doing something that would actually do something about crime. The fact that we are prosecuting criminals and putting them in jail for a longer amount of time is what is making the crime rate go down. There are enough laws on the books right now that would take care of all gun crimes if we would only enforce them.
Some of have said that folks don't need assault rifles to hunt with. No one said we would hunt with them. As long as free Americans have access to weapons we will stay free. If the Government had all the weapons and the citizens had none.....well, that thought just scares me. I reckon we would still be under the rule of Great Britain.

[PimpDaddy]

but its perfectly ok for this f**ktard "the leader of the free world" to feed everyone a nice hefty shovel full of BS every now and then?


http://www.thespoof.com/picstore/thespoof/davidbaker_mad%20bush.jpg

Could you be more specific ?? Big deal.... you find someone with photoshop skills and the topic is on guns - whats the first thing you think of -- OH !!! I got it.... let me post the most recent hate bush picture i can find. Lets start a thread on cutting and pasting a picture of someone on another picture...... I got one !!! Kerry on a waffle box !!

[Fragetti]

If guns are outlawed only outlaws would have guns
Frag :)

[UZI]

Hey PimpDaddy. Great to see you again!!!

LMAO --- Good one on the Kennedy Car. I am guessing that most of these young ones were not born when the good old Senator Kennedy incident occurred. Dead women tell no tells.

[UZI]

Slice,
Please help me understand what you mean when you quoted me on the first page of this string. You quoted me and then talk about some conspiracy theory that had nothing to do with my post. Maybe you got a little mixed up on who said what?

[solid snake295]

you compleatly missed my point Pimp, Bigg said he dosent like how micheal moore makes s**t up and tells people its true, well is it ok for george bush to do that? becuase we all know that he does. "blah blah, WMD's blah blah" ya right, he just needs an excuse to kill someone.

the picture was just added for effect. :worldssma
i was going to put in a normal picture of him, but when i did a search for george bush that was one of the first pics to come up.... go USA :rolleyes:

[OPTIMOOSE]

I wish everyone would open there eyes and realize that guns dont make the world go round, war doesnt solve much, guns kill. I have seen both bowling for columbine and 9/11 and its kinda scary to realize there is actually some truth to these facts. Bush is not capable of being a president.. he couldnt even fly a plane in the national guard.. He didnt skip the test, he failed it, with poor standards, and somehow he covered that up.

Bush is just a puppet! This whole Iraq thing has gotten out of hand - innocent people dieing. Those who have be persecuted have fled to Canada - Just due to there decent.

As for Guns? Who needs a frigging ar15 at home? I love canada, no problems like this.. No NRA bull****..

[OPTIMOOSE]

http://www.freedomunderground.org/memoryhole/pentagon.php#Preloader

most have seen this im sure..
im not around here enough to keep tabs on all posts

[UZI]

That's pretty bad Optimus. You don't gain credibility in life just making stuff up because you are upset. Bush qualified to fly. He flew. Deal with it. I am guessing that you are qualified to fly military jets, and that is why you are sitting in judgement of President Bush's skills on flying Military Jets.

This part aimed at a broad audience and not you Optimus:
Here is a challenge. The next person who calls any person stupid, not capable of etc., a plotting murderer of people around the world. Sit in judgement on yourselves as well. Tell us why we are to believe that you are so much smarter, so much braver, so much more accomplished in life than the person you are crapping all over. A little hint, I would not include the fact that you spend hours in front of a screen playing imaginary games where you get to pretend that you are someone you are not. Save that for Hollywood, Right?

A nobel prize winner maybe. A great world class athelete. Maybe you served honorably in our US military and became an awesome killing machine (remember that doing this on a computer does not qualify). An honor graduate from a top university in some technical field and now you are considered an authority nationally. Maybe you invented some great cure for a disease. Maybe you got elected to be a world leader by millions of people. A leader who is still supported by millions of people (like it or not who also think all of these conspiracy theories are wacked). But hey, you are spending your time on GM, so you must have access to tons of info. that nobody else has. My guess is you were all successfully voted in as President of the US by millions of people, but maybe decided to give it away. And you are probably smarter than all of the rest of us combined. That's why you can sit here and crap on a person you never met. It must be why you can slice a guy up every time he stumbles a word when making a speach infront of millions of people around the world. I am guessing most of you do these speaches every day. Yeah, I am guessing that that is the case.

Do you crap on people around you in every day life who don't do everything as good as you? Are you one of those people who watches a professional athlete playing a sport and coaches at the TV screen like you are an all pro player --- "Man, you need to make those shots and play better defense --- man you dropped the ball, you suck".

Yeah yeah what a world this is becoming. Please excuse me while I wipe my butt.

[Slice]

That's pretty bad Optimus. You don't gain credibility in life just making stuff up because you are upset. Bush qualified to fly. He flew. Deal with it. I am guessing that you are qualified to fly military jets, and that is why you are sitting in judgement of President Bush's skills on flying Military Jets.

This part aimed at a broad audience and not you Optimus:
Here is a challenge. The next person who calls any person stupid, not capable of etc., a plotting murderer of people around the world. Sit in judgement on yourselves as well. Tell us why we are to believe that you are so much smarter, so much braver, so much more accomplished in life than the person you are crapping all over. A little hint, I would not include the fact that you spend hours in front of a screen playing imaginary games where you get to pretend that you are someone you are not. Save that for Hollywood, Right?

A nobel prize winner maybe. A great world class athelete. Maybe you served honorably in our US military and became an awesome killing machine (remember that doing this on a computer does not qualify). An honor graduate from a top university in some technical field and now you are considered an authority nationally. Maybe you invented some great cure for a disease. Maybe you got elected to be a world leader by millions of people. A leader who is still supported by millions of people (like it or not who also think all of these conspiracy theories are wacked). But hey, you are spending your time on GM, so you must have access to tons of info. that nobody else has. My guess is you were all successfully voted in as President of the US by millions of people, but maybe decided to give it away. And you are probably smarter than all of the rest of us combined. That's why you can sit here and crap on a person you never met. It must be why you can slice a guy up every time he stumbles a word when making a speach infront of millions of people around the world. I am guessing most of you do these speaches every day. Yeah, I am guessing that that is the case.

Do you crap on people around you in every day life who don't do everything as good as you? Are you one of those people who watches a professional athlete playing a sport and coaches at the TV screen like you are an all pro player --- "Man, you need to make those shots and play better defense --- man you dropped the ball, you suck".

Yeah yeah what a world this is becoming. Please excuse me while I wipe my butt.
Your points aren't valid. You contradict yourself left and right. Earlier today I said I am done with the political threads in these forums in another thread and I am. So I will not be giving you any responce other than this, to what you have asked of me because it's all just a bunch of useless horsesh1t. Thanks and goodluck!

[OPTIMOOSE]

Actually UZI I read today in a newspaper about bush military career, said he wasnt qualified, didnt meet standards, and they basically said, "Give this plane to someone else more qualified to fly"


I dont make things up, im not in politics..


And ...
http://www.lior.org/photography/gallery/concerts/bluesfest2002/images/I_am_Canadian.jpg

[merkwannabe]

Actually UZI I read today in a newspaper about bush military career, said he wasnt qualified, didnt meet standards, and they basically said, "Give this plane to someone else more qualified to fly"


I dont make things up, im not in politics..


And ...
http://www.lior.org/photography/gallery/concerts/bluesfest2002/images/I_am_Canadian.jpg:rofl: Man, Canadians are so lucky!!

Anyway, I just thought I'd step in and say please stop flaming each other. It's getting old and I think it needs to end. If your gonna flame, at least do it in a more interesting thread. I think it's awesome people are finding possible conspiracys involving 9/11 and I think most "facts" can be interpreted as lies in politics.. So give each other some credit, because apparently nobody knows the truth in this thread.. Or at least, that what you keep saying to each other..!!

"lies.. lies!!"

[EXEcution]

everything is a lie, the world is merely a computer simulation

[JIMINATOR]

what the heck was this thread about again?
I find myself easily distracted....

[ZeLL]

kind of an off topic question from the whole gun thing. Can't really contribute cause i never really cared about gun control.

But, how many guys or gals here would be willing to send there kids to iraq to fight, or go themselves?

not making a smart comment, i just want some honest responses.

[ZeLL]

i'm 17 at the end of the year, and i can say without thinking twice that i wouldn't go to iraq.
I'm deffinately down with the army. maybe one day i'll even join up, but this is not the time or place to do it :/

[Die Hard]

I reckon we would still be under the rule of Great Britain.
What a great idea :D

[PimpDaddy]

kind of an off topic question from the whole gun thing. Can't really contribute cause i never really cared about gun control.

But, how many guys or gals here would be willing to send there kids to iraq to fight, or go themselves?

not making a smart comment, i just want some honest responses.
Zell, that is a valid question that the left and liberals use constanty.... would you send your kid to Iraq ????

The answer is overlooked.................... The last time I checked, and correct me if I'm wrong...... we have an ALL VOLUNTEER army. The left wont admit that we have a great sense of patriotism in this country and we actually have people that will fight to maintain the freedoms for the same people that will trash bush, burn flags and make movies like m.moore (a.k.a. socialist a$$ esq)

[PimpDaddy]

Earlier today I said I am done with the political threads in these forums in another thread and I am. So I will not be giving you any responce other than this,
Thank god we don't have to read any more of it either !!!!!!!!!!!

[PimpDaddy]

Bush is just a puppet! This whole Iraq thing has gotten out of hand - innocent people dieing. Those who have be persecuted have fled to Canada - Just due to there decent.


Yes, you are so right optimus..... dont you wish we could go back to teh days when sadam was mass murdering over 300,000 of his own people ?? I kind of liked the rape rooms he had set up for his 2 deranged sons that would have carried on his tradition. .... and who can forget the torture chambers ???? oh the good ol days huh ??

[PimpDaddy]

you missed 3 posts...................... scroll up a few !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[merkwannabe]

Yes, you are so right optimus..... dont you wish we could go back to teh days when sadam was mass murdering over 300,000 of his own people ?? I kind of liked the rape rooms he had set up for his 2 deranged sons that would have carried on his tradition. .... and who can forget the torture chambers ???? oh the good ol days huh ??dood, nobody thinks innocent people dying is a good thing. I'd be more than willing to go and help those people, but that's obviously not the only thing they are doing. Why are people rebelling? I think it's because we are trying to take over. Maybe their treatmeant towards women is not right, but it's their culture and unless we "destroy" all of them, it's almost out of the question to take over.. I think we should put things back in order and leave. Save the people who are suffering the most and destroy the worst of the terrorists.

Actually, I don't pay attention much to news so my statement can be and probably is entirley wrong... SIGH SIGH..

I think it's lame when people complain about one party or another.. The differences between almost all politicians is very slight.. So stop blaming one group over the other.. It's individual people who make the difference,(ex: the President), not parties in the long haul.. :cool:
[another blind statement] ahaha

[CaptainKeyes]

WTF is this crap. Great let the crooks get the weapons that the Cops can't fight against.

Way to go Bush.
you could aquire every single one of those weapons legally through loopholes.
and even if guns were banned in entirely criminals would still have access through the black market here in the states... so all the wrong people would have access to guns.

[ME BIGGD01]

due to the people not knowing aanything about the ban before it started, this thread is locked:mad:

[merkwannabe]

due to the people not knowing aanything about the ban before it started, this thread is locked:mad::confused:

I guess the thread has experienced a lot of twists..

(as in, we lost track of the main point of the topic...)

[PimpDaddy]

dood, nobody thinks innocent people dying is a good thing. I'd be more than willing to go and help those people, but that's obviously not the only thing they are doing. Why are people rebelling? I think it's because we are trying to take over. Maybe their treatmeant towards women is not right, but it's their culture and unless we "destroy" all of them, it's almost out of the question to take over.. I think we should put things back in order and leave. Save the people who are suffering the most and destroy the worst of the terrorists.

Actually, I don't pay attention much to news so my statement can be and probably is entirley wrong... SIGH SIGH..

I think it's lame when people complain about one party or another.. The differences between almost all politicians is very slight.. So stop blaming one group over the other.. It's individual people who make the difference,(ex: the President), not parties in the long haul.. :cool:
[another blind statement] ahaha
Why are people rebelling ?? who is the people you're talking about ?? The terrorists and fanatics that continue to blow up innocent people to make america look bad, or the demonstrators in the u.s. that aid and abet the terrorists by believing it is wrong to help a country try and become a free and democratic nation ?? I'm not sure which people you're refrering to here bro........

[JIMINATOR]

dont you wish we could go back to teh days when sadam was mass murdering over 300,000 of his own people ??

sadly i don't believe that we are accomplishing anything in iraq/afganistan. imo as soon as american forces are gone it is going to be rule of the most ruthless, back to business as usual. they will be back to commiting atrocities upon the population, and the rest of the muslum world will not give a damn as long as foreigners are not involved. not that that will stop their terrorism.

[UZI]

Jim,
Just as all things in life though, you have to be willing to try. Because the answer to allowing these ruthless people to stay in control is that nobody is safe. Our nation learned that lesson on Sept. 11 and we will repeat that lesson again as people's resolve faulters.

Do you honestly believe that if we had not taken out the Taliban in Afg. the attacks against the US would have stopped. Read a history book on WWII that covers the social issues. There were Americans who were against going to war when Japan attacked Pearl Harbor. We did not have to go to war as a result of Pearl Harbor. We could have simply fortified our defenses on the mainland and waited for the next attack (same as what is being said by many with the war on terror). Who gives a crap that the Germans were killing off the Jews. Was not happening in the US. Who cares that the French, English and other Europeans were getting killed. Was not happening on our own soil. Why did my uncles, my mother-in-laws father and other youth of our country have to go to war and die in Europe to free those people. With Germany fighting the Soviets, they would have never been able to accumulate the strength to invade the US. And Japan was stretched way to thin controlling China to have sustained an invasion of the American Mainland.

To answer a previous post about my child serving in the military and getting called up to deliver on his oath (Iraq, Europe, Canada etc) I would be proud that he joined into something that he strongly believed in. Committed to his ideals to the point that he would risk his life. That was the reason that I joined.

And if he died as a fire fighter, trying to save some stranger that I never knew, I would be very proud of him also.

I don't think the military is for everyone. You don't join just to pay for college, or to have a job, or to learn a skill, or be tough. You only join because it is a passion to serve your country. Because you believe that a great nation like America can only exist because people are willing to sacrifice for the good of a nation. It was true in the revolutionary war, and it is true today, without people willing to fight and die for a cause like freedom for all --- for life, liberty and the pursuit of happeness --- a world will not have these. When I was in, I didn't run into very many who joined for the wrong reason. There are some, but not many. And some Moms, Dads, brothers etc. don't understand this drive in their children, and the press seeks them out. But some do.

I am tired of trying to explain this, so I will stop. You either have passion, morals and beliefs in life that you try to live by and fight for --- or you cut in line ahead of someone who you know was rightfully ahead of you in line.

[Slice]

Thank god we don't have to read any more of it either !!!!!!!!!!!
Funny how my middle finger happen to get an erection when I read this post. You must have turned me on....

[ZeLL]

yo pimp you didn't answer the question though. if a son or daughter of yours was going to iraq, would you say "good for you" or "why?"

[UZI]

And Jim,
Please don't see my post to you as a flame of any kind (I re-read my post and just wanted to clarify). I have read your technical section posts and think you are probably one of the smartest people on GM. I also think from your posts, that you are pretty level headed. Much more than me, anyway.

[PimpDaddy]

yo pimp you didn't answer the question though. if a son or daughter of yours was going to iraq, would you say "good for you" or "why?"
It would be entirely their decision bro. My oldest son is in college and getting a pretty healthy dose of socialist indoctrination and he's told me before if he ever got drafted, he would move to Canada. He is very anti-war and could never pull the trigger on another human being.
My younger son (senior in high school) said he would go if drafted, but as of right now doesnt think he would join.
I would support whatever they wanted to do.

[JIMINATOR]

Well, the idealism is fine, but i think the people hate us, and i don't believe going in with military force is changing anyone's opinion. they have our highly subsidized gas, and like an iraqi was quoted, it better stay that way or there will be rioting. i am tired of all the rioting. as for atrocities, they are occuring in many places worldwide, and we pretty much don't give a damn unless there is oil or other resources for us to rape and plunder. 100,000 killed in africa in 30 days? not a problem. you can bring up the morality crap all you want, and sure, that is what the soldiers are doing, but the reality is that it is all about the benjamins, and no oil means that we wouldn't be there....

[Slice]

It would be entirely their decision bro. My oldest son is in college and getting a pretty healthy dose of socialist indoctrination and he's told me before if he ever got drafted, he would move to Canada. He is very anti-war and could never pull the trigger on another human being.
My younger son (senior in high school) said he would go if drafted, but as of right now doesnt think he would join.
I would support whatever they wanted to do.
I say good for them. I mean no disrespect towards you at all being they are your kids, but it takes a lot for them to stand up to their parents and express how they feel. It doesn't mean your opinion goes with out notice. I respect your opinion and theirs just the same.

[ZeLL]

It would be entirely their decision bro. My oldest son is in college and getting a pretty healthy dose of socialist indoctrination and he's told me before if he ever got drafted, he would move to Canada. He is very anti-war and could never pull the trigger on another human being.
My younger son (senior in high school) said he would go if drafted, but as of right now doesnt think he would join.
I would support whatever they wanted to do.

:thumbs:

[merkwannabe]

Why are people rebelling ?? who is the people you're talking about ?? The terrorists and fanatics that continue to blow up innocent people to make america look bad, or the demonstrators in the u.s. that aid and abet the terrorists by believing it is wrong to help a country try and become a free and democratic nation ?? I'm not sure which people you're refrering to here bro........oh... I dunno.. I think I was referring to the terrorists or natives who are beheading americans and blowing up cars.. (I'm not sure exactly who they are.. :confused:)

ANYWAY, there are people rebelling and that's why American troops are "banned" from many parts of the middle east.. Well, not banned, but they stay away because they are too dangerous.. BAH, I don't know.. These are all little tid bits I get from glancing at the tv and what not..

I just think we should help everyone we can... and in this case, I think we can only go so far before it becomes only benefitial for us. As in, we will be contoling them and forcing them to live a lifestyle they don't appreciate.. :confused::(
I hereby ban myself from these threads.. tah tah.

[Die Hard]

as for atrocities, they are occuring in many places worldwide, and we pretty much don't give a damn unless there is oil or other resources for us to rape and plunder.
Zimbabwe
Sierra Leone
Uganda
Sudan
Palestine
Albania
North Korea
China

To name but a few....

Well said Jim:thumbs:

[Pure_Evil]

Yes, you are so right optimus..... dont you wish we could go back to teh days when sadam was mass murdering over 300,000 of his own people ?? I kind of liked the rape rooms he had set up for his 2 deranged sons that would have carried on his tradition. .... and who can forget the torture chambers ???? oh the good ol days huh ??

If I could roll the clock back and not invade Iraq, you bet your ass I would, that would save 1023 American lives!! Save a lot of American families a lot of pain! Iraq is not and was not our problem. The people of Iraq can take care of themselves. They were not begging the USA to invade their country and bail them out. Keep in mind that the # of Iraqi civilians killed by military intervention since the war began is between 12721 and 14751. At least we're not near the 300,000 mark yet :rolleyes:

The basic hypocracy of Saddam killing killing his people is not why we went in, we were looking for WOMD, if we went in to stop him from killing his own people, then why didn't we go into Darfur to stop "genocide" :hmmm: I'm going to quote, once again, a post from one of our soldiers, who was in Iraq.

I spent a year in Iraq sitting on my thumb just cause somebody thought there was actually a military there. Sure, I walked clost to a thousand miles while I was there, spent many thousands of hours on guard duty, did countless searches and attacks throughout the country. But what did we actually acomplish that the Iraqi people couldn't have done on their own? All it would have taken was a simple upriseing, and Sadam would have to out faster than you can flush a toilet. I have no simpathy for any of them, and if they want to continue letting these things take place in their own country then I say "Screw Them!" They aren't helpless. They are human beings with brains, and should be able to figure out how to solve their own problems.

Now that's not from some liberal press, a Republican, Democrat, that's from one of our soldiers who's lucky enough to survive his tour, and in 2 weeks his 3 years stint in the Army is up, and he's out.

Also keep in mind that every Iraqi household is legaly allowed to have one AK-47 with a full mag for self defence! So a uprising wouldn't have been as hard as it is to do in the USA.

What the UN was doing before the war started was working, not perfectly, but Sadam was contained and so far, no proof that he had WOMD or even a sizable millitary.


To get back on track. Since the ban is lifted, and luckily my state has strict laws that take care of this problem, I say just let the police be armed better and free them up to use deadly force more often to level the field. If the criminals are going to arm themselves, let the police be a bit more free to kill them and free up some court time. Also be a bit more lenient when they make a mistake.

[Die Hard]

And if they kill a member of your family while making a mistake, that would be fine huh?

As you know, our police force is un-armed (apart from special response teams) and we have little gun crime. Sure criminals can gety hold of guns but most don't because they don't need them.

If we armed the cops you can bet your last cent the criminals would be armed up to the hilt!

Guns = Guns

[Pure_Evil]

No, it would not be fine, but my brother is in law enforcement, so I do not say arm the police more without viewing both sides.

I can safely say that all members of my family are smart enough to do what they are told by law enforcement which in turn lowers the chance of them being killed by a police officer.

If it's a case of wrong place, wrong time, that's just life. Police are trained to work in extreme conditions, but they are only human and can screw up too, and don't deserve to be crucified for it.

[Pure_Evil]

Also, you have not armed your police, are you saying if we dissarmed ours, the criminals would turn in their guns????????

It's great they way things are for you in the UK, but we do not have the same options.

[Die Hard]

Yep, I sympathise with the situation over there. But surely if you give the cops more fire power then the crims will just do likewise. It could spiral out of control.

[PimpDaddy]

What the UN was doing before the war started was working, not perfectly, but Sadam was contained and so far, no proof that he had WOMD or even a sizable millitary.

Lotsa good points Pure, but this one is just plain wrong. U.N. resolution 1450 was ignored 18 times. How many more times would Sadam have waved his nose at the world? No proof that he had wmd's ???? He USED them - on his own people in northern Iraq. Over 300,000 people died. He HAD them. The resolution wanted to determine what he did with them.... or was that all he had? So when people say there is no proof that he had them, they are factually wrong. He DID have them. Sure would like to know where they are !!

[JIMINATOR]

i don't think the gun issue is a cops/criminals relaitonship. i know you can probably get guns through very illegal channels in britain, but for the most part probably nobody has any guns to sell. Contrast that with america, where guns are available in your local department store, gun dealers and many street corners. Many people have guns, many with multiple guns. Not that I am ripping the "right to bear arms" but really that has become stupid and obsolete, and was added when the theory was that if the government ever became corrupt the population could defend itself with guns. But in today's society with the military, the citizen weaponry is obsolete....

[PimpDaddy]

I say good for them. I mean no disrespect towards you at all being they are your kids, but it takes a lot for them to stand up to their parents and express how they feel. It doesn't mean your opinion goes with out notice. I respect your opinion and theirs just the same.
My wife gets up and the leaves the room when we start talking politicks:D Me and my sons always reach the same conclusion........
Politicians SUCK !!!! The more you learn about politicks, the more pi$$ed off you get.

[Pure_Evil]

Lotsa good points Pure, but this one is just plain wrong. U.N. resolution 1450 was ignored 18 times. How many more times would Sadam have waved his nose at the world? No proof that he had wmd's ???? He USED them - on his own people in northern Iraq. Over 300,000 people died. He HAD them. The resolution wanted to determine what he did with them.... or was that all he had? So when people say there is no proof that he had them, they are factually wrong. He DID have them. Sure would like to know where they are !!

When were the 300,000 killed in comparison to when we invaded. ?

[CaptainKeyes]

WHy in the world would that matter....
does it make it any less valid
hell no

[PimpDaddy]

When were the 300,000 killed in comparison to when we invaded. ?
now we split hairs..... big deal. they're dead. oh well.

[Pure_Evil]

now we split hairs..... big deal. they're dead. oh well.

I didn't see it as splitting hairs, I wanted my memory refreshed as to when the 300,000 were killed seeing that you said that was your proof that Sadam had/has WOMD. I don't remember the President or the CIA saying that Sadam just killed 300,000 people, let's take him out now. For some strange reason I just can't say "oh well" about the 1025 dead Americans and the 7125 wounded over WOMD that the inspectors said weren't there and the Bush administration said were there :dunno:

9/11 death toll= 2,795

War in Iraq =1025 dead, 7125 wounded and counting.... even though it's been said that the war ended 5/1/03

[OPTIMOOSE]

Yes, you are so right optimus..... dont you wish we could go back to teh days when sadam was mass murdering over 300,000 of his own people ?? I kind of liked the rape rooms he had set up for his 2 deranged sons that would have carried on his tradition. .... and who can forget the torture chambers ???? oh the good ol days huh ??

The problem is the USA wants to rule the world, let the iraqies deal with there own PROBLEMS..

Show me these so called weapons of mass destruction - where are the nukes??

Why cant you guys understand that the BUSH family supports the BIN LADENS..?

LOL

[Slice]

The problem is the USA wants to rule the world, let the iraqies deal with there own PROBLEMS..

Show me these so called weapons of mass destruction - where are the nukes??

Why cant you guys understand that the BUSH family supports the BIN LADENS..?

LOL
Your wife is hot! :)

[OPTIMOOSE]

HAHA SLICE..
You remember the picture? Do you have it saved lol?


THANKS
Joe

[ZeLL]

I didn't see it as splitting hairs, I wanted my memory refreshed as to when the 300,000 were killed seeing that you said that was your proof that Sadam had/has WOMD. I don't remember the President or the CIA saying that Sadam just killed 300,000 people, let's take him out now. For some strange reason I just can't say "oh well" about the 1025 dead Americans and the 7125 wounded over WOMD that the inspectors said weren't there and the Bush administration said were there :dunno:

9/11 death toll= 2,795

War in Iraq =1025 dead, 7125 wounded and counting.... even though it's been said that the war ended 5/1/03

i wish i could have something to add to that pure but you ****ed it up man :)
:thumbs:

[ZeLL]

here's something that just occured to me.

saddam was never really a popular guy in iraq right? i'm pretty sure not too many of his citizens would take a bullet for him. so who are we fighten right now in Fallujah? deffinately not all saddam special forces. If i had my country sh1t to the point of, what was it, 12,000-16,000 casualties of my own people, i wouldn't be too fricken thrilled.
you could deffinately expect some retaliation.

so who exactly is there to liberate?

[ME BIGGD01]

The problem is the USA wants to rule the world, let the iraqies deal with there own PROBLEMS..

Show me these so called weapons of mass destruction - where are the nukes??

Why cant you guys understand that the BUSH family supports the BIN LADENS..?

LOL
no offence but, i think that's the dumbest thing i read in this thread and think canadians should worry about and comment on there own country. wee, wee.....

[OPTIMOOSE]

Its funny BIG but I live right beside the USA, I talk to americans everyday, I work with the public. I spent 10 years in the USA going to school, enjoyed every minute, especially when these cocky americans tried to bully me around for being canadian.. :) They lost.

Everyone loves canada, I just cant seem to figure it out though.. hmm.. still cant understand why.. maybe its the lack of guns? Or is it the healthcare? Or maybe we make love not war... Canada is culture rich..

I love CANADA, oh and we own the world in HOCKEY.

Really the only people who have lost anything in this war is the USA, how many need to die for this cause?

Theres no answer to any of this, your president will do whatever he wants..

VOTE KERRY!

[ME BIGGD01]

i really have no opinion on canada. all i know about canada is their beer sucks and that the people think they are better than american. i was directing the comment more to bush supports the laden's comment.

also you say cocky americans. are you referring that all americans are cocky? i think in your tone it appears you are bias toward america and links to my comment above.

so canada, what have you done for the world ever?

[OUTLAWS Tip]

I don't own a gun. Actually I've never shot a gun. (except for a .22)








I do try and keep in shape and work on my "Duck and Run" strategy.
:p:

[PimpDaddy]

Why cant you guys understand that the BUSH family supports the BIN LADENS..?

LOL OMG !!!! Another socialist mike moore lemming...... right out of his handbook. ya follow him around like little sheep. (sorry to defame sheep that way goober).

[Insomnia]

are they going to ban paintball guns as sweLl?!?!

[OPTIMOOSE]

i really have no opinion on canada. all i know about canada is their beer sucks and that the people think they are better than american. i was directing the comment more to bush supports the laden's comment.

also you say cocky americans. are you referring that all americans are cocky? i think in your tone it appears you are bias toward america and links to my comment above.

so canada, what have you done for the world ever?


Our beer sucks? LOL my butt, we have americans that come over to my family's beer store and buy truckloads, because our beer actually has more the 5% in it. They say american beer is like water.

So who Bush Sr meeting with? Wasnt it true that the Bin Laden family was in the USA just before all the stuff hit the fan on Sept 11th?

Did you know that..............................

a Canadian invented the broadcasting of voice and music by radio? Reginald A. Fessenden’s first broadcast in 1904 made him the father of modern radio. Imagine where the music industry would be without him!

a Canadian invented Standard Time? In 1878 Sir Sanford Fleming divided the world into time zones to increase the accuracy of scheduling travel over long distances by train. We still use these to this day. Okay folks, synchronize your time zones!

in 1833 John Patch, a Canadian, invented the nautical screw propeller that propels most watercraft today? Records indicate that he was dissuaded from patenting his invention and it later emerged from England. Do you think that this could have influenced the design of the airplane propeller?

that the Macintosh apple was invented by Canadian John Macintosh in 1796? Every single Macintosh apple tree is rooted in the history of the very first Macintosh, discovered by John Macintosh growing on his farm in Dundas County, Ontario. We still love our Macs!

Canadian, Dr. John A. Hopps invented the Heart Pacemaker in 1950? Millions, including the Doctor himself, have benefited from this lifesaving device. Canada, giving heart beat to the world!

Canadians invented the Imax Movie System? In 1968 Grahame Ferguson, Roman Kroitor and Robert Kerr revolutionized the world of film with this larger than life invention. Entertaining people around the world!

a Canadian invented one of the World’s most popular and powerful programming languages in use today? JAVA is the 1994 invention of Canadian, James Gosling. Where would the World Wide Web be without it!

a Canadian invented Polymerized Methyl Methacrylate? Do you care? You should. In 1931 William Chalmers invented Plexiglas. It is not broken by millions of people everywhere!

a Canadian invented one of the most important fuels of the mid-1800’s? In 1846 Doctor Abraham Gesner invented Kerosene, and it soon provided light to the homes of North America. Canada, always lighting the way!

a Canadian, Norman Breakey of Toronto, invented the Paint Roller in 1940? This invention is said to have kick started the whole Do-It-Yourself movement. We are happy that he wasn’t given the "brush off"!

a Canadian invented the electric light bulb? Bet you thought it was Edison right? No, Henry Woodward of Toronto invented the electric light bulb in 1874 and sold the patent to Thomas Edison a few years later due to lack of funds to develop the idea. Lots of bright lights in Canada!

a Canadian invented the Anti-Gravity Suit? In 1941, Wilbur Rounding Franks invented a suit to allow pilots to withstand the high G forces resulting from high-speed maneuvers in fighter planes. It is the forerunner to the current day space suit. And you thought that all we contributed was the Canadarm!

Canadians, Eli Franklin Burton, Cecil Hall, James Hillier and Albert Prebus co-invented the electron microscope in 1937? This amazing achievement opened the doors to medical and scientific discoveries for generations after its invention. There is nothing too small for Canadian ingenuity!

a Canadian invented newsprint? In 1838 Charles Fenerty, inspired by his observations of a wasp’s ability to build a paper nest from wood, invented a process to create pulp paper. Today, Canada supplies newsprint to almost half of the World’s newspapers. Imagine a world without the tabloids!

5 Pin Bowling is as much a Canadian sport as Hockey? T.E. Ryan of Toronto invented it in 1909. Those who have played it know that it is as deceptively easy as cricket. And in typical Canadian style there are no variables except skill!

a Canadian invented the Automatic Postal Sorter? In 1957, Maurice Levy invented a postal sorter that could handle 200,000 letters an hour. Just imagine how slow it could have been!

the Robertson Screw is a Canadian invention? In 1908, Peter L. Robertson decided that there had to be a better screw fastener. He was right and the superior Robertson square-headed screw was the result. It is predicted that some day our American cousins will discover its superior capabilities as well!

the Snowblower is a Canadian invention? In 1925, Arthur Sicard invented a self-propelled 4-wheel drive Snowblower that revolutionized the snow clearing process. Our friends in northern New York and Vermont have never stopped thanking us!

Insulin, and its use in the treatment of Diabetes, is a Canadian invention? In 1921, Dr. Frederick G. Banting and Dr. Charles H. Best, working together at the University of Toronto, isolated insulin, thus revolutionizing the treatment of diabetes and extending countless millions of lives worldwide!

a Canadian, James Floyd designed the first jetliner in 1949? When the Canadian-designed Avro Jet Liner first flew in 1949, it was North America's first and only commercial jet! It never went into production. Now you have more than the Avro Arrow to be mad about!


I could go on posting stuff up all day long, this is not a competition of who country is better. I would live in the USA, but i choose Canada. I have relatives all throughout the USA.

[He Is Legend]

dont forget about terrance and phillip!!!

[Nitro]

that was a stupid ban anyway.
2nd amendment shouldnt be savagely attacked with laws like the assault weapons ban and its a good thing that it has finally expired

[Slice]

5 Pin Bowling is as much a Canadian sport as Hockey? T.E. Ryan of Toronto invented it in 1909. Those who have played it know that it is as deceptively easy as cricket. And in typical Canadian style there are no variables except skill!

I am so glad that you mentioned this. Where would we be with out 5 pin bowling. ROFLMAO Let's see how hard that was to invent. Eureaka, lets have the same game as bowling but with half the amount of pins. The room clapped and then designated him as a genius. :rofl:

[PimpDaddy]

Why just last night, me and the wife were sitting around bored and I said "honey, we must go do some 5 pin, its been such a long time."

[EXEcution]

Why just last night, me and the wife were sitting around bored and I said "honey, we must go do some 5 pin, its been such a long time."
:D :rofl:

[UZI]

LMAO :rofl:

[Dan2]

One of Bush's 2000 campaign pledges was to sign a renewal of the assault weapons ban. I bet he thanks God the bill never reached his desk.

It sickens me to hear politicians say and promise anything during the campaign, only to do a 180 once in office.