Power Supplies

[BobtheCkroach]

Ok, I've decided for sure that my PSU is on the fritz. So I'm going to be getting a new one soon. I know that Antec is generally recognized as the best there is, so does anyone have a particular model that they'd like to recommend? Also, how much power do I need?

My specs are:

CPU: AMD Athlon XP 3200+
Mobo: MSI K7N2 Delta
Video: GeForce 5600 FX 256 mb
Sound: Onboard 5.1
DVD Drive
CD Burner
80 gig HDD

Any help would be awesome, thanks!

[JIMINATOR]

for antec: a 300W would probably be fine if you want to lowball it, else look for a 400 or 450. if you want to splurge, get a tru-power. if you want to splurge for the future, get a neo-power....

[Caged Anger]

hmm, I've heard they make a fanless one thats really cool, really efficient at cooling, and really expensive. In other words, exactly what Jim wants and needs, right?

[BobtheCkroach]

so...this is about what I'm lookin' for, Jim (if I wanna "splurge" a little)

link (http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=17-103-908&depa=0)

One last thing, then...is there anything I need to double check regarding compatibility w/ my mobo? If so, where would I find that information?

[BobtheCkroach]

hmm, I've heard they make a fanless one thats really cool, really efficient at cooling, and really expensive. In other words, exactly what Jim wants and needs, right?

Yeah, I ain't payin' no 169 for a power supply...

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=17-103-925&depa=0

[JIMINATOR]

its compatible. the only thing new on power supplies is some that have an extra 4 pins on the MB ribbon cable for the latest sli - pci-express rigs (even then its optional, not required), and maybe sata power connectors, but if you are not going to be ugrading any time soon, no real reason to spend the money....

[FUS1ON]

When I upgraded from the generic PSU that came in my case, this is what I went with. The thing almost weighs twice as much as the generic one did. It's specs compares pretty much evenly to the Antec and is cheaper.

http://www.newegg.com/app/viewproductdesc.asp?description=17-153-006&DEPA=0

[Grimmy]

I love my Thermaltake PS as well. :) It went with my Thermaltake case :D

[BobtheCkroach]

When I upgraded from the generic PSU that came in my case, this is what I went with. The thing almost weighs twice as much as the generic one did. It's specs compares pretty much evenly to the Antec and is cheaper.

http://www.newegg.com/app/viewproductdesc.asp?description=17-153-006&DEPA=0

Woah! That's way cheaper! I'm willing to trust ThermalTake instead of Antec if you guys are vouching for the quality!

I like that way better than 75!

Thanx, guys! :thumbs:

[Caged Anger]

cheap rocks, especially from newegg

[BobtheCkroach]

Ok, after some thought and discussion, I guess I'd better do a bit more talking before I just assume that it's the PSU...I think the symptoms suggest it, but it'd be best to be sure before I drop 40 bucks, I suppose.

Here's what's happening:

A few months ago, I started getting warnings while playing UT2k4. Basically, PC Alert, the system-monitor app that came w/ my mobo, started going off, b/c the level on the 3.3 voltage was dipping too low...after talking to some GM folk, the judgement was made to simply reduce the lower limit, and after doing so, it stopped. About 2 weeks, ago, I installed a game and after 10 minutes, my entire system died. Not a jam. The computer literally just turned off, as if the plug into the wall had been pulled. I was like "um, ok" and pushed the power button...nothing. No juice at all - as if it was still unplugged. I had to wait 30 seconds before I could get it to even power up. I started the game again and then same thing happened. So i uninstalled the game. 2 days later, it happened again, this time while playing Galactic Battlegrounds with my little brother. This time, though, the level on the +12 voltage went off for like 2 seconds, then the comp died, again needing 30 seconds before it would power on at all. It happened again today with UT2k4. It's becoming more and more frequent...

So there you have it...reports that my voltage is low...both 3.3v and 12v...currently, they're running at 3.04 and 11.28 (ouch! I believe). After the voltage hits a low, the computer craps out, and I have to wait about 30 seconds before I can get anything from my computer.

I guess before I go buying a new PSU, i'd just like someone to confirm that indeed, this is a PSU thing, as opposed to "it could be a PSU ,or a mobo, or a ..."

Reassurance is good...

So what do you think?

[FUS1ON]

Once it gets a load on it and starts to get hot, it starts to fail and even shuts off, that sounds like a failing PSU to me. Just to make sure, do you or one of your buddies happen to have a extra PSU to stick in there for awhile?

[BobtheCkroach]

Once it gets a load on it and starts to get hot, it starts to fail and even shuts off, that sounds like a failing PSU to me. Just to make sure, do you or one of your buddies happen to have a extra PSU to stick in there for awhile?

That's a good idea...I'll have to look into that (I don't personally, but I'm sure someone around here does...PJ...)

[Slice]

Is your box clean? Is the power supply clean and it is getting plenty of air from the fan to keep it cool?

[BobtheCkroach]

Is your box clean? Is the power supply clean and it is getting plenty of air from the fan to keep it cool?

Another good question...I'm not gonna be home til tomorrow night, so i'll have to look into that then.

[Caged Anger]

suggestion, buy a couple cans of air.

(not that you don't have more than enough to get the job done yourself, but you don't need to be any mroe lightheaded than you already usually are...)

[BobtheCkroach]

Well, my fellow GameMeccians, here's the deal. I borrowed a Power Supply from PJ - a 480 watt. not a big name like antec or thermaltake, but enough that it should work just fine for a test...and my machine did the same thing. So I ask - what is the best place to look for the answer? Which component is most apt to cause this kind of freaky failure?

Or, is it possible that I have too much stuff runnin' on one power strip? Currently, I have my computer, my monitor, my radio, and my surround sound subwoofer and speakers all running of this one power strip...but nothing but the computer goes out, so i'm apt to think it's not the strip...

Any thoughts? This really really sucks!

[JIMINATOR]

next, borrow his video card and see if it does the same thing....

[BobtheCkroach]

next, borrow his video card and see if it does the same thing....

That was kinda my thought. Any video card should work, right? I mean, I have an old GeForce 4 64meg sitting around...that should be enough to test this, right?

[Caged Anger]

curious, have you checked your board's capacitors? Look for liquid, its usually a sign of bad things going on

[Slice]

What are your temps? MB and Core during the games?

[BobtheCkroach]

What are your temps? MB and Core during the games?

Well, my machine has always run a little hot. I believe when I originally put the board and proc in, it ran @ 70C when I was playing games. I was told that was a bit high, but acceptable. The in-game temps seemed to have gone up... The idle temps are still about the same, though. Anyways:

At idle, the proc is 52C and the system is 37C. I booted up UT2k4 and this is what I got.

3 minutes in: CPU: 64C; System: 41C
5 minutes in: CPU: 70C; System: 43C
7 minutes in: CPU: 74C; System: 45C
10 minutes in: CPU: 77C; System: 47C

and it died at 12 minutes.

Whether the vid card ends up being the problem or not...those are not good trends...

[BobtheCkroach]

I may have just found my problem...I pulled the side of my box and took a look...there was a good deal of dust in there, no doubt about it, but nothing *super* out of the ordinary, until...I looked at the video card. There was a huge coating of dust on the fan, first of all. So i pulled it, and to my horror - there was literally a MOUND of dirt under the fan...the fan was still circulating just fine, but there was so much under it that I have no doubt that the GPU was probably not getting any kind of cooling. So, tomorrow, I will be getting compressed air and nuking the dirt. Hopefully that clears it up.

[JIMINATOR]

:rolleyes:

[BobtheCkroach]

:rolleyes:

Shut up, you! In any case, I'm gonna probably pull my CPU fan and blow that out at some point, too - something I've never done. Is there a brand of Thermal Paste that I should go with? And can someone give me the low-down on proper application of thermal paste?

Also...I manually blew out the fan and wiped around it w/ a Q-tip...nothing real clean, but better than before...it took it 4 extra minutes to hit 77, and 4 extra to cause the system to die...so looks like that's a start (the mobo under the video card fan is coated in dirt...

Lookly like cleaning every 3 months is gonna be necessary instead of 6 months to a year...crap.

In any case, what CPU paste would you guys recommend?

One more thing, also...back when I got my new CPU/Mobo, I asked about getting a fan, which fan would be a good recommendation, etc...and didn't get a whole lot of info...does anyone have a specific heatsink/fan for an Athlon XP machine that they know performs well? Perhaps part of the reason my machine is so hot is that I got a crappy heatsink/fan?

[JIMINATOR]

dust is an insulator, it makes things retain heat. i recommend canned air all the time because the velocity of the air shakes dust loose. for heatsinks, you don't really much more than stock unless you are overclocking. if you want, you can get a copper or a copper base heat sink, large fan, etc. most come with a thermal pad mounted. or you can clean your existing heat sink & cpu (denatured alcohol), spread a very thin layer of compound on the cpu chip (artic silver is highly thought of, but expensive @ $14, other brands are around $7). No specific heatsink recommendations, the more fins, bigger the fan, and the more copper it is made of the better. really i doubt you will need much more than blowing the case out (including the powersupply, which also will have a tremendous amount of dust in it). if you have the equipment you can always lap your heatsink, that means to grind it down perfectly flat and sand it until it has a mirror finish for the best heat conductivity.

[OUTLAWS Tip]

If I had those temps I would definately remount my processer/heatsink fan.
I've always used Artic Silver, but have read they are all about the same. You only have to use a little bit, about the size of piece of rice.
Instructions from their site:
Instructions (http://articsilver.com/arctic_silver_instructions_small.htm)

[BobtheCkroach]

Hmmm...I cleaned out the whole case today, and my dad had some heat sink paste around, so we put that on. The case was very dirty - the heatsink had a TON of dirt clogging it up. The new numbers on my case are:

Boot up UT2k4: CPU: 44C; System: 34C
2 minutes in: CPU: 50C; System: 35C
5 minutes in: CPU: 55C; System: 37C
7 minutes in: CPU: 54C; System: 38C
10 minutes in: CPU: 56C; System: 38C
13 minutes in: CPU: 56C; System: 39C
18 minutes in: CPU: 57C; System: 39C
24 minutes in: CPU: 57C; System: 39C

Those numbers are a lot better than 77 @ 10 minutes, machine dies at 12!

Also, those numbers are lower than they've EVER been...in fact, even when the machine was brand new, if I booted up Doom, i'd get to 65C just sitting at the opening screen - so I'm very happy with these numbers! Look's like I'll be cleaning a bit more often!

Thanx to all those who gave suggestions!

[OUTLAWS Tip]

Nice, good job.
:thumbs: :thumbs:
I clean the fan screen on my box every couple of weeks and redue the cpu/heatsink about once a year. Between cat hair and me smoking it is a mess in there.
:o

[BobtheCkroach]

Nice, good job.
:thumbs: :thumbs:
I clean the fan screen on my box every couple of weeks and redue the cpu/heatsink about once a year. Between cat hair and me smoking it is a mess in there.
:o

Luckily I have neither of those...I just have the dustiest room on God's green Earth.

[Chaotic42]

I seriously advise against skimping on your PSU. It's the single most important piece of hardware in your system. I always recommend PC Power and Cooling, just because I've had excellent personal experiences with them. Not cheap though.

I had an Antec TruePower 550 and it melted the ATX connector. Even if the PSU isn't the cause of your problems, I'd be looking for a quality PSU.

[JIMINATOR]

i doubt the antec melted your connector. heat is caused by resistance. it would take a dirty connector to melt the connector. another possible source would be the capacitors near the connector getting too hot. this has happened with the last pentium overclocked on older boards. true enough though about getting a good psu. just I have never had a problem with an antec. anyway this thread is old...

[Chaotic42]

Wow, I didn't notice the date on it.

As far as the Antec, the power connector was burned badly on the 5V wires. The plastic was destroyed and the metal scorched. I'm not sure what happened. I'm running a system with the same hardware and a PCP&C PSU and it's working wonderfully.